Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby JuliaAJA » Thu Aug 27, 2009 4:43 am

What happens when the player controlling a monarch leaves a nation? I control the Queen of Beiteynu and I promised the only party in Talmoria that they can have limited control of my King.
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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby Khaler » Thu Aug 27, 2009 11:54 am

That is one question I have been thinking about. What if a player institutes a monarchy, then leaves the nation, and there is a revolution, is that monarch still that players characater even though he is not in the nation? Or does that character become public property and they can hang him or whatever they like.
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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby GreekIdiot » Thu Aug 27, 2009 12:05 pm

They may claim whatever they wish since the owner party has left the nation. Nevertheless, the specific party has the right to deny the RP, and may refuse to accept those claims, which is legitimate. But anyhow, the outcome of the monarch is part of the fictional RP, and his removal is game mechanics. It just depends if the player controlling the monarch reacts negatively to the revolutionary claims regarding assasination and whatever, in which case those claims are not legit, since he still controls the specific monarch.

Hope it's clear...:P
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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby Mr.Yankees » Fri Aug 28, 2009 2:41 pm

George wrote:They may claim whatever they wish since the owner party has left the nation. Nevertheless, the specific party has the right to deny the RP, and may refuse to accept those claims, which is legitimate. But anyhow, the outcome of the monarch is part of the fictional RP, and his removal is game mechanics. It just depends if the player controlling the monarch reacts negatively to the revolutionary claims regarding assasination and whatever, in which case those claims are not legit, since he still controls the specific monarch.

Hope it's clear...:P


This is the reason why we need to reform the "rules" and modify previously adopted precedents.
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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby Khaler » Fri Aug 28, 2009 4:58 pm

Well, let's say player controlling the monarch leaves a country and then the other players want to continue that line of monarchs, but the creator is inactive. Do they just have to abandon that line and make up a new one as they can't RP descendants for the monarch as it is not their character?

Say like if I created Richard the Lionheart, the great king of luthori, I could now claim "na-ah, I deny this RP" and entire history of great Luthori monarchs would have to be removed as it breaks the rules (meaning being descendants of Richard)?

Makes no sense, so the rules should be changed.
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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby GreekIdiot » Fri Aug 28, 2009 9:39 pm

Rules are based on mutual consent and whenever its vague essence is not assumed, we do have a problem, even with rules available and at hand.

Unfortunately I can't solve that case but I would personally let the line continue since it is beyond the control of the player creator. As unfair it may seem, it would be the most logical solution next to deleting the whole who-knows-how-much-it-extends line completely for a simple glitch.

Also, I don't think someone would mind if a whole line was created based on their creation.
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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby Darvian » Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:12 pm

Normally under these circumstances it isn't a problem as the fleeting former monarch is replaced; no big deal. What I want to know is since when did we start transferring political parties from nation to nation while still obtaining rights to a former political party in another nation? Doesn't make much sense to me. It all works out in the wash though. If I am the monarch in nation X and have some rp'ed lines, companies, alliances and I leave; I leave-ties severed. I've dealt with this a lot in-game, surely others have to. If the player in nation X moved off but, no prompt monarch was installed I can hardly see by the aforementioned logic how the former player could control a character of his that was nominally given up. It ought be the monarch/players duty to establish a cause when warranted; if not I think it is the players rights via the mechanics to change things as needed hence consent is handed over when the former now inactive player in nation X moved off without some type of interim solution.
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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby Duke Matthus » Sat Aug 29, 2009 1:37 am

As a monarchist and leader in the IML, I can answer some of the questions here about lines and claims.
For the lines and claiming of such, that is why the IML Leadership votes on whether a monarch is a monarch. Now it sounds crazy yes, but we ask questions such as:

1) What is your claim to the throne?
2) Are you the rightful heir, other words, do you carry any of the blood of the first or previous ruling Dynasty?
3) What is your back history?
4) If someone with a higher claim challenges you, what will be your reaction? (Best example is Trigunia with Hulstria and Delteria)
5) How related is your monarch to that nation and its culture, and if not at all how will you preserve it and keep it from becoming just like yours?

These are just a few of what we ask when people ask to be recognized by the IML and thus be considered monarchs instead of just dictators with fancy titles. So while the said line of a monarch may die out, if you married into that line before hand, you can easily claim the throne and start a new one.

Now Richard of Luthori is just a pain, and I had to make up excuses for him, since no man has lived to be over 300 and he ruled for 300 years. So work with what you have.


If you have any questions on monarchs and claims, I will be happy enough to answer them for you along with any leader of the IML.

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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby Cold » Sat Aug 29, 2009 4:23 am

These sort of things should be addressed on a case-by-case basis. For instance, if I created a monarchy/business/organization in Nation X and then I left for Nation Y, in most cases I no longer have control over those things. However, say I came to Nation Y to establish the same monarch/business/organization from Nation X (See Terran Caliphate). I would still have control of the character in both countries unless otherwise stated. So should my monarch be assassinated in Nation X, while I'm in Nation Y, I would still be involved and essentially decide on the validity of the assassination.

Make sense?
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Re: Hereditary leader is RPed by a Party -- WTF???

Postby Jay (LDP) » Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:06 am

Cold wrote:These sort of things should be addressed on a case-by-case basis. For instance, if I created a monarchy/business/organization in Nation X and then I left for Nation Y, in most cases I no longer have control over those things. However, say I came to Nation Y to establish the same monarch/business/organization from Nation X (See Terran Caliphate). I would still have control of the character in both countries unless otherwise stated. So should my monarch be assassinated in Nation X, while I'm in Nation Y, I would still be involved and essentially decide on the validity of the assassination.

Make sense?


In the case of a monarchy, if you were insistant on moving from Nation X to Nation Y, why should you still be controlling the monarchy in Nation X? You're no longer playing there, you have no legitimate connection that nation, IMO. If you wanted your monarchy to remain in that nation, it's your responsibility to either remain in that nation to look after it OR appoint another person to represent your monarchy in that nation. If we followed your idea, Jess could go around to every single nation, set up the same monarchy and leave a week later whilst still claiming to be the monarch of every single nation he's been in. In my opinion if you're wanting to have the one monarchy in control of various nations, you must have one person representing the monarchy in each and every applicable nation.
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