Requests: RP Laws [RPC]

Submit your requests on various areas of the game.

Moderator: RP Committee

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby House Spencer » Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:20 pm

Auditorii wrote:I remind ALL users that at the end of the day Moderation has, had and always will reserve the right to enforce, make, remove and otherwise manage the game and it's rule as they see fit.


:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Ya & don't I know it. Arbitrary Rule.

I think this is what Occam meaned by Decisionism

BTW thanx for teaching me that word, Occam
House Spencer
 
Posts: 116
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:42 pm

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby Auditorii » Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:22 pm

House Spencer wrote:
Auditorii wrote:I remind ALL users that at the end of the day Moderation has, had and always will reserve the right to enforce, make, remove and otherwise manage the game and it's rule as they see fit.


:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Ya & don't I know it. Arbitrary Rule.

I think this is what Occam meaned by Decisionism

BTW thanx for teaching me that word, Occam


It's a private game, operated by private individuals who are granted their authority to carry out their duties. It is what it is. Your moral compass, my moral compass, somebody else's moral compass of "fair" or "unfair" matters very little in the grand scheme of things. The decision they've made is final, my advice to you is move on and get past it otherwise you're going to be very very unhappy.
Image Dorvik | Image Zardugal | Image Ostland (FBC)
Moderator
-- Particracy Game Rules
-- Moderation Requests
-- Game Information
-- Particracy Discord
Auditorii
 
Posts: 6279
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2017 2:51 am

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby House Spencer » Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:29 pm

Auditorii wrote:
House Spencer wrote:
Auditorii wrote:I remind ALL users that at the end of the day Moderation has, had and always will reserve the right to enforce, make, remove and otherwise manage the game and it's rule as they see fit.


:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Ya & don't I know it. Arbitrary Rule.

I think this is what Occam meaned by Decisionism

BTW thanx for teaching me that word, Occam


It's a private game, operated by private individuals who are granted their authority to carry out their duties. It is what it is. Your moral compass, my moral compass, somebody else's moral compass of "fair" or "unfair" matters very little in the grand scheme of things. The decision they've made is final, my advice to you is move on and get past it otherwise you're going to be very very unhappy.


If you want to continue this pls pm me. This threads not about you and your demands for people you disagree with to shut up.
House Spencer
 
Posts: 116
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:42 pm

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby lewiselder1 » Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:05 am

Jesus H Christ this is getting excessive now.

The old RP Law is invalid, the new one is recognised, for practical purposes; this debate is getting a bit old now and clearly not going anywhere, there’s no need to continue in my opinion, publicly or privately.

Can we all move on and stop this insanity? There’s no need to argue with each other, and frankly not much to discuss now is there? Though I do think Farsun makes some good points in there with regards to rules etc.

It’s just silly now.
I go by Ashley now and use she/her pronouns. This is a really old account, I don’t play now.

I was a mod in classic for a bit, then I helped make Marcapada and WM there for a while. As of 2020 I’m co-ordinating Pachapay’s development.
User avatar
lewiselder1
 
Posts: 647
Joined: Thu May 04, 2017 8:35 pm

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby House Spencer » Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:31 am

I do not mean to be an annoyance Lewis but you missed my Important Question.

http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=576058

Please explain how this "RP Law" was valid with specific reference to the bolded parts of the aforementioned rules:

i.To create an RP law you must: clearly label it as an RP Law, pass it through your nation's legislature with either a simple majority of seats if it is a regular law or a ⅔ majority of seats if it is a constitutional law and reference it clearly in your nation’s “Bills under debate” section. To query a new RP law’s legality a user should post on the RP Law Query Thread.
ii.To overturn or abolish an RP law you must pass a bill with a simple majority which explicitly mentions which law you are scrapping and provides a link to the original law. You should then post a link to the bill on the RP Law Dismissal Thread.
iii.An RP law must not contradict game mechanics or the game rules, or force users to act a certain way OOC. Additionally they cannot ban types of parties (without considerable RP justification) or users. RP Laws must also not force users to vote in a particular way.
iv.Moderation reserves the right to declare any RP law invalid in exceptional circumstances.


As well please explain why (ii) is not being followed. If it is "unnecessary and confusing" why is that requirement even there?
House Spencer
 
Posts: 116
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:42 pm

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby lewiselder1 » Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:10 am

House Spencer wrote:I do not mean to be an annoyance Lewis but you missed my Important Question.

http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=576058

Please explain how this "RP Law" was valid with specific reference to the bolded parts of the aforementioned rules:

i.To create an RP law you must: clearly label it as an RP Law, pass it through your nation's legislature with either a simple majority of seats if it is a regular law or a ⅔ majority of seats if it is a constitutional law and reference it clearly in your nation’s “Bills under debate” section. To query a new RP law’s legality a user should post on the RP Law Query Thread.
ii.To overturn or abolish an RP law you must pass a bill with a simple majority which explicitly mentions which law you are scrapping and provides a link to the original law. You should then post a link to the bill on the RP Law Dismissal Thread.
iii.An RP law must not contradict game mechanics or the game rules, or force users to act a certain way OOC. Additionally they cannot ban types of parties (without considerable RP justification) or users. RP Laws must also not force users to vote in a particular way.
iv.Moderation reserves the right to declare any RP law invalid in exceptional circumstances.


As well please explain why (ii) is not being followed. If it is "unnecessary and confusing" why is that requirement even there?


Oh I see, only just realised what you meant. Haha!

i) Labelling it ‘RP’ is probably enough really. In future I’d suggest ‘RP Law’ but prior to this debacle I think that’s fine.

ii) We’re overruling it in exceptional circumstances, as Farsun said; that’s useful in general, but in this specific instance wouldn’t help, so we’ve temporarily overruled it to ensure the smooth running of the game.

iii) As a rule of thumb, the game mechanics should be respected, but the only real change here is that you imagine they only apply to part of the nation, so I think that’s passable.
I go by Ashley now and use she/her pronouns. This is a really old account, I don’t play now.

I was a mod in classic for a bit, then I helped make Marcapada and WM there for a while. As of 2020 I’m co-ordinating Pachapay’s development.
User avatar
lewiselder1
 
Posts: 647
Joined: Thu May 04, 2017 8:35 pm

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby House Spencer » Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:33 am

That didnt add up for me but maybe its never going to
House Spencer
 
Posts: 116
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:42 pm

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby Occam » Sat Aug 18, 2018 10:25 pm

Auditorii wrote: I remind ALL users that at the end of the day Moderation has, had and always will reserve the right to enforce, make, remove and otherwise manage the game and it's rule as they see fit.

That would be the ruin of the game. Not to mention a massive failure of the Moderators. If you can't adhere to the rules you made up yourself, you really can't expect anyone else to do so. Neither can you expect them to have even the slightest respect for you.
Permanently gone.
Occam
 
Posts: 129
Joined: Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:45 pm

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby House Spencer » Sat Aug 18, 2018 10:30 pm

Occam wrote:
Auditorii wrote: I remind ALL users that at the end of the day Moderation has, had and always will reserve the right to enforce, make, remove and otherwise manage the game and it's rule as they see fit.

That would be the ruin of the game. Not to mention a massive failure of the Moderators. If you can't adhere to the rules you made up yourself, you really can't expect anyone else to do so. Neither can you expect them to have even the slightest respect for you.


+1

but if Mods do leave the rules aside then they should at least admit it & be honest IMHO, not pretend rules are perfect and they are following them perfectly when that aint the case.

then Id respect more
House Spencer
 
Posts: 116
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:42 pm

Re: RP Law Query Thread

Postby lewiselder1 » Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:19 pm

House Spencer wrote:
Occam wrote:
Auditorii wrote: I remind ALL users that at the end of the day Moderation has, had and always will reserve the right to enforce, make, remove and otherwise manage the game and it's rule as they see fit.

That would be the ruin of the game. Not to mention a massive failure of the Moderators. If you can't adhere to the rules you made up yourself, you really can't expect anyone else to do so. Neither can you expect them to have even the slightest respect for you.


+1

but if Mods do leave the rules aside then they should at least admit it & be honest IMHO, not pretend rules are perfect and they are following them perfectly when that aint the case.

then Id respect more


The rules are the primary mandate for moderation and will in nigh on all circumstances be adhered to. However, there are three things of note; first, Moderaion ultimately reserves the right to make exception to the rules in exceptional circumstances; to make the final judgement on their interpretation and implementation; and finally, Moderation does ultimately derive its powers from Wouter, not from the rules, and while Moderation is usually bound by the rules, Moderation can step outside of them if justifiably necessary. They’re not the law and if we see Moderation as an extension or delegation of Wouter, if it’s necessary to ensure the game runs right and it’s an exceptional or important matter, Moderation has every right to act outside of them. In other words, Mods are expected to stick within them, but are not exclusively bound by them. I believe this is the point Farsun was trying to make.

That isn’t to say it should be a common occurrence, and in 95% of cases they are strictly adhered to, but in that 5% of cases Moderation must have the ability to step outside of the rules.

In other words the truth is somewhere between the two; Moderation should never be dictators, but are also never 100% bound by the rules 100% of the time; the primary goal of Moderation is to ensure the game runs smoothly and fairly, the former by occasionally stepping outside of the rules and the latter by almost always staying in them.
I go by Ashley now and use she/her pronouns. This is a really old account, I don’t play now.

I was a mod in classic for a bit, then I helped make Marcapada and WM there for a while. As of 2020 I’m co-ordinating Pachapay’s development.
User avatar
lewiselder1
 
Posts: 647
Joined: Thu May 04, 2017 8:35 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Requests

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests