Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby Aethan » Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:55 pm

Chrysa Contou, Selucian Minister of Foreign Affairs

It is not in the plans of the Selucian Government to leave the Majatran Alliance. Selucia, as a democratic nation, allows the freedom of expression in its cities and regions, and that is why the manifestation against the Majatran Alliance was allowed. Selucia, as a democratic nation, allows its citizens to openly disagree with the Government. However, and although polls are being conducted to check the general opinion of our citizens regarding the Majatran Alliance, the official position of the past Government and the new Government is exactly the same: for now, Selucia will remain in the Majatran Alliance. It is our duty as a democracy to help other nations in achieving this ultimate goal.

Majatran values are the values of the whole continent, and therefore no single nation can dictate them or can say something goes against them just because in their own nation things are done differently. As an example, the right to bear arms is not something intrinsic to the Majatran culture, but rather to modern legislation in modern nations. I will not stop in the issues of vaccinations or paramilitaries because... I appreciate my position. But Mrs. Caespasius, tolerance means respect to every single individual. Including LGBT people and other minorities.

In the same way, even though this Alliance was born as an economic union, it was born also as a continental union, which means bringing all nations together in order to avoid the horrible mistakes Majatra has committed during its past history and that many nations seem to frequently forget. Of course, we can only be an economic union.
But why should the money of my nation, hardly made and won by its own citizens, go to a nation that prosecute people of my own kind, or that uses it to sustain hereditary title holders that have done nothing else?

Selucia long ago decided to remain neutral, with huge support from its own citizens, and that is why many Selucians are asking our government to leave the Alliance.
Because we don't want to be accomplices of any nations that undermine the rights of its citizens, while our citizens can easily enjoy them.

We do see the Chart as an opportunity to discuss the current issues of our continent, and to create a chart where all of us can easily identify with. And this can only be achieved through dialogue, not through accusations. That's what we ask to all the present members.

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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby Polites » Wed Mar 07, 2018 8:37 am

Lofrkadkai Nrlbábé, Barmenian Minister of Foreign Affairs,

I fear we may have been misunderstood. We are not arguing against the Charter itself, and in fact our government attempted its ratification, though it was ultimately prevented by the Barmenian deep state. What we are proposing is that the Charter not be used as a tool to criticize and sanction non-compliant members. As a developed and stable liberal democracy, Istalia may not be aware of this, but poorer nations know that human rights are expensive. In our own nation, although we have banned torture and extrajudicial killings, we occasionally uncover instances where the police torture suspects for information and sometimes abuse their powers and suspects end up missing. This is not because of official Barmenian policy, and indeed our government has been cracking down on police abuse and other human rights violations. If any Majatran government wishes to eliminate torture or other instances of police brutality, they need a well funded and transparent investigatory institution to monitor the police, a purge of non-compliant police forces, and higher salaries for the replacements. In a prosperous and stable nation like Istalia that is a straightforward and simple solution. But in a developing nation like Barmenistan, we need to justify using our limited resources for this rather than developments more likely to help people, like investing in healthcare, infrastructure, or education. So our answer to this conundrum is simple: we as a Majatran organization need to do more to promote stable economic development, focus our energies on integrating and growing Majatran economies, and support rather than sanction vulnerable governments like that of Deltaria. If we do this everything else will follow. Otherwise we end up justifying the arguments of nations like Pontesi that the human rights ideology is merely a softer version of civilizing colonial imperialism.
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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby 13ShinyTie » Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:31 pm

Aurora Adorinda, Minister of Foreign Affairs of Istalia

Speaking to Pontesia is like speaking to a deaf person, absolutely impossible. We are asking for any potential improvements, they claim that we inhibit on the right to bear arms which is non sense, it is as if we are talking to a tape recorder, which cannot answer our questions. Nevermind that.

On the other hand, with the Barmenian Delegation we could not agree more, as enforcing laws is much more expensive than simply passing them, but that is what the MA is for and we would be happy if the contributions of larger nations economically of the Alliance would go to such causes. However, at the moment a lot goes to unjust laws which we simply do not see contribution as reasonable. These unjust laws do not include "smoking in public buildings" but severe cases of human rights violations such as the denial of citizenship to anyone but landowners.

Thank you.
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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby Polites » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:41 am

Lofrkadkai Nrlbábé, Barmenian Minister of Foreign Affairs,

We are happy to find ourselves in agreement with the Istalian Delegation, and we do agree that a legislative framework advancing human rights is imperative, difficulties enforcing it notwithstanding. What we remain concerned about, however, is the Alliance's policy of sanctioning members that fail to implement such legislation. In Barmenistan the Shahrán and Nrlshehré administrations have committed all available resources to fighting corruption and human rights abuses, but our position remains vulnerable. The Old Guard have been blocking our reforms at every step, and it is entirely possible that they will ultimately succeed in destroying Barmenistan's reform project. If that does happen, we are concerned that potential future sanctions and suspension against our nation will not only prevent the deterioration of governance, but even embolden it. Which is why we find it very much in our own self-interest to oppose the sanctions policy, not because we believe autocrats and oligarchs should not be punished, but because we fear such sanctions do not work. This is also why we are advocating for continued trade and economic support for all member states, regardless of their political and legal system. It may seem counter-intuitive to reward governments that violate human rights with trade and economic support, but we firmly believe that the only solution to this problem is economic development. Another source of concern for our government is the fact that sanctions are far easier to introduce than to remove, and we believe the example of Deltaria is telling in this case. Although the original cause of the suspension is no longer in place, and the post-civil war government has achieved a consensus for gradual reforms, Deltaria remains suspended, and we fear the suspension may not be lifted any time soon. For this reason we call for the suspensions of Deltaria and Kafuristan to be lifted as soon as possible.
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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby Elf » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:09 pm

Joanna Caespasius, Pontesian Minister of Foreign Affairs

I wish to bring forward the Pontesian government's request for emergency funds from the Alliance, due the natural disaster that recently befell our fair country.

As for certian things that have been said in this chamber - well... The anti-intelectualism displayed towards our political system by people apparently viewing themselves as important world leaders boggles my mind. Pontesia is built upon basic republican principles of citizen democracy and confederalism. We respect the human rights and dignity of all of our people. We simply have standards you see, we believe that power should come with a responsibility. As our own sovereign explained, a person without a stake in the state budget cannot be adequately responsible for it. We are a government for the people and do not wish to fall to the modern illnesses of promising more and more of other peoples money to get more voters. This is 100% in line with modern, liberal values and the ideology of capitalism. Pontesia is also respecting its natural, organic, leaders of the civil society - the aristocracy - rather than forcing that role to be taken by career politicians and bureaucrats. In many ways, the Pontesian system cannot be described as anything but a libertarian utopia.

While people with same sex attraction certainly deserve the same respect for their dignity as everyone else, we do not adhere to agendas that seek to break up the norm of the natural nuclear family unit, and we reserve the right to restrict harmful and unusual sexual practices for the sake of the common good.

I must also add, on the subject of respecting the dignity of other individuals, that I abhor some of the statements made by certain Istalians, referring to cute animals as "beasts". It borders hate speech and I cannot take anyone claiming to be some sort knight-in-shiny-armour championing causes like human rights seriously, while engaging in denigrating behaviour towards other living beings, condoning cruel experiments against them for the sake of profit, or murdering human babies on the unholy altar of radical feminism and egalitarianism for that mater. Using Istalian logic, perhaps Pontesi ought to start bombing Istalian universities where they experiment on animals or aboriton clinics? Or at least start financing radical groups doing such things?

Or perhaps Istalia should simply mind its own business and stop pretending to be a northern country in the ocean half-way to Artania. Majatra is not well suited for aggressive Cultural Meztist liberalism, and anyone who champions such behaviour will fail to be relevant on the Majatran political scene. I must declare quite openly, that if this behaviour continues against the original founding principles of this institution, Pontesia may find itself forced to contemplate Istalia's suspension from the Alliance.
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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby Polites » Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:57 am

Lofrkadkai Nrlbábé, Barmenian Minister of Foreign Affairs,

Barmenistan supports Pontesi's request for emergency funds, however we require that a regulatory body be appointed to oversee these funds and make sure they are strictly used for their intended purpose. We would also caution against providing direct aid to the Pontesian government in their reconstruction efforts, and rather support a policy of allowing Majatran investment in construction, provided by private companies, NGOs, and religious organizations.

As for the heated rhetoric in this organization, we have no wish to chastise any member government for their legal system. We reiterate our argument that while the Charter provides a valuable goal for all Majatran nations, the way to achieve this goal is through economic growth. If it is our wish to see the Pontesian oligarchy removed from power, then the way to do that is to make them irrelevant by promoting economic cooperation and good governance. Governance is good when it is participatory, inclusive, and accountable, so democracy is necessary for good governance, but on its own it is not a guarantee for stability and human rights. It is rather economic development together with democracy that will guarantee a prosperous and united continent. It is the belief of the Barmenian government that the main cause of Majatra's political and social retardation and all of its wars and genocides is uneven development. The geographical periphery of the continent, represented by Zardugal, Vanuku, and Istalia, have achieved unprecedented levels of development and prosperity, while the center remains underdeveloped and unstable. The developed nations have for centuries attempted to spread their economic and political systems to the center, out of misguided humanitarianism and a less than idealistic desire for expanding their spheres of influence, and instead of leading to the poor nations adopting free markets and democracy, these actions led to instability, conflict, and a backlash from the Old Guards in the nations of the center, who saw their position threatened and turned to militarism, nationalism, and genocide as a way to remain in power. Even worse, the misguided attempts of the developed nations to spread democracy to the center and the resistance of the Old Guards often led to radical revolutionary uprisings and further deterioration of governance and stability. We thus strongly urge Istalia not to become the next Pax Zard, unless they wish to see the next Deltarian Empire or MRSF rise against them and destroy all the good efforts of this organization. We instead call on Istalia and all members of the Alliance to give their best efforts at guaranteeing regional development and economic cohesion, if not from a desire to help the continent's inhabitants then for the benefit of Istalia herself.
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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby 13ShinyTie » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:28 pm

Aurora Adorinda, Minister of Istalian Foreign Affairs

We believe to be on the same page as the Barmenian delegation. Also in regards to aid for Pontesia, to which it is entitled to as a member of the alliance.
Now in terms of economic development, would the Barmenian delegation consider an economic charter of the Majatran Alliance, which was mentioned by my predecessor. Istalia does not have the intention to chastize the other nations, however we all must understand that we are hesitant regarding providing investment to nations with a dubious government, especially if the funds are going to be used for communist purposes. Hence if there is a specific proposal regarding economic Majatran development, we would like to hear it - especially if it is cheap and effective in Implementation , and would not inflict on Pontesia's dear traditions. As we all agree I hope that we all can not just keep going like we are now in constant stagnation ignoring all major struggles of this alliance.

Furthermore, the cancellation of suspension of Deltaria is being discussed in Istalia and we are wondering what other member nations have to say.
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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby Polites » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:40 pm

Lofrkadkai Nrlbábé, Barmenian Minister of Foreign Affairs,

We are glad to find ourselves in agreement with the Istalian delegation, and we would fully support an economic charter. What we propose is the establishment of a common budget of the Alliance to which all members would have to contribute in proportion to their own wealth and the creation of a Majatran investment fund. We propose that this fund be used to invest in modernizing economic structures, infrastructure, and research and innovation in the Alliance's least developed economies. In order to allay fears that this fund would be used to create rent-seeking systems and to support autocratic regimes, we propose to make accessing these funds conditional on the fulfillment of several policy criteria, to be determined by an independent, transparent, and well-funded watchdog organization created with Alliance funding. We also suggest that the central governments be bypassed as much as possible, to make sure funding goes directly to financing the relevant projects. Ideally this system would create an economic incentive for member states to liberalize their economic and political system without the need for heavy-handed sanctions or other retaliatory measures.
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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby Aethan » Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:33 pm

Chrysa Contou, Selucian Minister of Foreign Affairs

Selucia supports the Barmenian offer in the help sent to Pontesi. In the same way, we are open to vote in favour of the reintegration of Deltaria in the Alliance,
while we don't think the reintegration of Kafuristan is possible yet.
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Re: Majatran Alliance's Allied Common Executive Commission

Postby Axxell » Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:17 am

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