OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

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OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby jamescfm » Sat May 09, 2020 3:32 pm

Below is an archived out-of-character discussion about the position of Yingdala in elections for the Security Council. For the current rules of the Security Council, please see the World Congress Information thread.

When the original boundaries were drawn to determine the four seats of the Security Council, Yingdala was placed alongside most of Seleya in Seat C. Although there is no formal position on which countries are part of which continents, most players consider Yingdala either part of Dovani or part of both continents. I don't think anybody really would argue that Yingdala is not part of Dovani at all. All of the other playable countries in Dovani (e.g. Seko and Lourenne) were placed in Seat D.

I have acknowledged in another post that the current seats system is at best quasi-continental but that doesn't mean we cannot try to improve it to better reflect our intuitions about which countries should be competing against one another. Liu Che, who has been responsible for representing Yingdala in the Security Council, has expressed the view that the country should be moved into Seat D to reflect its historic, cultural and geographic connection to Dovani. A few other players have signalled support for this change.

Re-locating Yingdala would provoke a few potential problems. The first is that it the seats would be less balanced numerically, with Seat C only containing 13 countries and Seat D containing 15. An easy way to fix this problem would be to move Vorona, a country without the same connection to Dovani, to Seat C in a straight switch.

Another potential issue is that it might upset the existing balance of power within the seats. Seat D already contains four of the nine most powerful countries in the game according to the military rankings, this would be adding another country with substantial history as a world power to the seat.

The other concern is a logistical one, I don't know exactly what the mechanism would be to add Yingdala to the options for Seat D and remove it from Seat C but it seems like this would probably involve Yingdala losing its current vote tally.

A few questions, then. Should Yingdala be moved to Seat D? If yes, should Vorona replace it in Seat C? How could this be achieved fairly without disadvantaging Yingdala in future Security Council campaigns?
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby John Cracker » Sat May 09, 2020 4:16 pm

I think they should be moved and replaced.
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby Luis1p » Sat May 09, 2020 4:33 pm

As much as I think it makes more sense historically and culturally, I think the way the Seats are currently structured should not change. I think Yingdala would have a better chance at getting a security council seat if it stayed at Seat C. Like James said, it is already way too crowded in Seat D in terms of the world's main powers. I don't necessarily think this would make it easier for Yingdala to be chosen. Sure it would make for an extremely competitive race, but as it currently stands, even with Yingdala not a part of it, it is already too imbalanced. I'd find it more difficult for Yingdala to be elected if added to Seat D, again it makes the most sense historically and culturally, but the chances for them could be slimmed down even more. Logistically as well, I don't know how far moderation's powers go to change it and how that would affect vote tallies. If this erases vote tallies, I'm afraid this would make elections unstable for some time if it is not done in a timely manner. I think a major restructuring, not just Yingdala, would have to take place if we're going to try and have the allocation of the seats make more sense.
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby Liu Che/Zhuli » Sat May 09, 2020 7:41 pm

I agree with Luis. I think this works only if there is a systematic change, but not even sure what that would be. When I do the math, we still get the same results, just swapping Vorona for Yingdala. It may not be worth it.
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby John Cracker » Sat May 09, 2020 7:51 pm

yea, it probably isn't.
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby colonelvesica » Sat May 09, 2020 8:29 pm

I'll speak it over with the Moderation Team
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby XanderOne » Sat May 09, 2020 8:55 pm

Actually I was one of the player who suggested this to Wu Han, I did it due to the cultural ties with Dovani. However it is also true that currently what underlined James is true.

Maybe in the future, because actually it is just an "issue" related to players and their RP in that dovanian nations. If there were no so much great powers probably it was the most logic thing to do.
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby colonelvesica » Sun May 10, 2020 5:24 am

XanderOne wrote:Actually I was one of the player who suggested this to Wu Han, I did it due to the cultural ties with Dovani. However it is also true that currently what underlined James is true.

Maybe in the future, because actually it is just an "issue" related to players and their RP in that dovanian nations. If there were no so much great powers probably it was the most logic thing to do.

Great Powers are fluid... at the time the Great Powers were spread literally across Terra.. that four of Terras most powerful nations are slotted in Seat D is just a reflection of Role Plag bith fortunately and unfortunately
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby jamescfm » Sun May 10, 2020 1:51 pm

Generally it seems that the consensus is to leave things as they are at the moment, then. I'll leave this thread open for a few more days just in case anyone else wants to share thoughts but I think we'll focus on other matters for the immediate future.

Thank you all for the feedback.
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Re: OOC: Yingdala's position in Seat C

Postby Liu Che/Zhuli » Sun May 10, 2020 1:54 pm

jamescfm wrote:Generally it seems that the consensus is to leave things as they are at the moment, then. I'll leave this thread open for a few more days just in case anyone else wants to share thoughts but I think we'll focus on other matters for the immediate future.

Thank you all for the feedback.


Thanks, James. I think that if there is a way to make the math work, there would be general interest.
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