Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby Rogue » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:34 pm

Istapali has been inactive. Yes. But it seems pretty rough that a month into it being active again it gets downranked like that. Not only that. But it is also a large nation, with many natural resources and a large population. I believe you were the one that named that significant factors in the size of a economy and thus, automatically in influence it may project. Again not advocating for a upgrade here. But a downrank one month into its activity doesnt make much sense to me.
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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby jamescfm » Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:05 pm

Mr.God wrote:Istapali has been inactive. Yes. But it seems pretty rough that a month into it being active again it gets downranked like that. Not only that. But it is also a large nation, with many natural resources and a large population. I believe you were the one that named that significant factors in the size of a economy and thus, automatically in influence it may project. Again not advocating for a upgrade here. But a downrank one month into its activity doesnt make much sense to me.

If your point is that the country should have been downranked before then I am inclined to agree with you but obviously there isn't much we can do to rectify that now. Part of the problem is that until recently the forum-based countries were ranked separately from the game's ordinary, playable countries and that meant it was difficult to compare them to one another. As I say I understand the frustration but I don't think even with the role-play that you did in that month there is sufficient evidence to justify maintaining it as an "middle power".
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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby Rogue » Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:17 pm

jamescfm wrote:
Mr.God wrote:Istapali has been inactive. Yes. But it seems pretty rough that a month into it being active again it gets downranked like that. Not only that. But it is also a large nation, with many natural resources and a large population. I believe you were the one that named that significant factors in the size of a economy and thus, automatically in influence it may project. Again not advocating for a upgrade here. But a downrank one month into its activity doesnt make much sense to me.

If your point is that the country should have been downranked before then I am inclined to agree with you but obviously there isn't much we can do to rectify that now. Part of the problem is that until recently the forum-based countries were ranked separately from the game's ordinary, playable countries and that meant it was difficult to compare them to one another. As I say I understand the frustration but I don't think even with the role-play that you did in that month there is sufficient evidence to justify maintaining it as an "middle power".


Just to clarify. That means it will take 45 ingame years before a change will happen (considering you have stated moderation will update it in 3 months). Honestly in 45 ingame years a LOT changes. And since i generally post a lot, that would mean literally hundreds of posts that would change a large amount in Istapali. Again if the rankings werent mandatory (which i believed them to be until recently) i wouldnt mind but now that they are it really limits the possibilities in the future.
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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby Rogue » Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:55 pm

In addition i would like to note. As far as i know the dynamic rankings were meant to be. Well. Dynamic. Constantly updated to reflect RP and geopolitical changes. I am just wondering if moderation plans on continuing it, or if its gonna step away from the dynamic concept
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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby jamescfm » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:03 am

As I communicated in a previous message, our current intention is to update the rankings around every three months. In reality it is possible that we will update them more frequently than this, as in the most recent case. Forty-five in-game years is probably a reasonable period of time to assume will elapse before the next rankings update then.

In my view it is worth noting that more time between updates was used in the past when the game was considerably more active than it is at the moment, so I don't think we are being unreasonable here. Aside from the reasons already mentioned, updating the rankings more regularly would leave them more open to players who produce a lot of role-play in a country over a short period of time then become inactive. The rankings are intended to represent the long-run position of the country, ultimately.

In some sense, there is always going to be a disagreement regarding the regularity of updates to the rankings: players will almost always argue for more frequent updates while Moderation (who are the ones doing the work on them) will prefer more time. With that said if there is strong player feeling that more regular updates are required then we will consider producing updates more often. At the moment though, I'm not sure that is necessarily the case.

Regarding the specific question of whether the rankings are "dynamic", I can't speak to the original intention of the term because it was before my time as part of the Moderation team. My own understanding though is that it was used to emphasise that the updates are not "scheduled" in the manner that they used to be. In the past when the rankings were the responsibility of the role-play team (or some variation of it), the updates were set to specific intervals. Under the current system, this is not the case.

Moderation does have an estimate of the time between updates but this is not fixed. If there were a zeitgeist-shifting role-play event (e.g. a major international armed conflict) in the next two weeks, for example, then Moderation would consider updating the rankings earlier. On the flip side, if nothing has really changed in role-play in twelve weeks then we might wait longer before another update. As far as I know, the rankings were never intended to be updated literally in real time.

Honestly, it doesn't seem to me that this is a realistic approach to military and political influence, nor to economic development. In the real-world, it is very uncommon to be able to even identify a single event as causing a "change in status" for a country. In those cases where it is possible from a historical perspective, such an event usually represents the culmination of many factors over many years.
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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby colonelvesica » Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:15 pm

Chitin and I have completed our Updating to the Dynamic Rankings

As always the community is invited and encouraged to offer their feedback on whether or not they feel a certain nation should be promoted, demoted based on Role Play we may have overlooked or missed, or to seek feedback why certain rankings occured.

Summary of Changes

Economic
Yingdala up to Very Strong
Deltaria, Endralon & Vascania on verge of up to Very Strong
Aldegar, Dolgava, Kalistan, Lodamun & Lourenne up to Strong
Dorvik on verge of down to Average
Hobrazia up to Average
Istalia down to Average
Bianjie and Utembo up to Weak
Cildania, Hanzen, Jakania, Malivia, New Alduria, Rildanor, Telamon & Vanuku down to Weak


Military & Influence
Deltaria, Liore, Vascania & Yingdala Rising to Great Power
Aldegar up to Regional Power
Aloria up to Middle Power
Istalia & Telamon down to Middle Power
Bianjie up to Small Power
Cildania, Hanzen, Jakania, Kanjor, Keymon, Medina, Rildanor, Seko & Vanuku down to Small Power

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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby robmark0000 » Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:23 pm

I am not really dissatisfied with this, however I would kindly ask that why Endralon is not a very strong economy already? I am just curious about the reasoning.
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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby colonelvesica » Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:39 pm

robmark0000 wrote:I am not really dissatisfied with this, however I would kindly ask that why Endralon is not a very strong economy already? I am just curious about the reasoning.

Most of Endralon's economic Role Play is focused on what it's corporations do overseas and in other nations, rather then how they are improving and expanding the Endralon economy locally. Endralon is one of the most connected nations, economically, in Terra and it's corporations are everywhere, and it does have an impact on expanding the over all economy. However, most of the jobs they would be generating would be in foreign nations where they are primarily mostly active, based on your Role Play.

BOPA for example buys a lot of oil... but most of that doesn't go back to Endralon for refinement, it goes from one port, and then it is moved to another nation as a direct sale, so Endralon doesn't really benefit from that type of transaction. This is just an example.

As we stated, you are growing, and arguably are on the verge of becoming a Very Strong Economy, just not there quite yet.
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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby Kubrick » Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:44 pm

Are these still non-binding as was announced somewhere last year?
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Re: Feedback: Dynamic Rankings

Postby colonelvesica » Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:47 pm

Kubrick wrote:Are these still non-binding as was announced somewhere last year?

You are correct, still non-binding. While we encourage players to respect them, these rankings are a joint reflection of activity within the nation, and the quality of that activity in the view of Moderation. These are to be viewed as general guidelines, rather then enforced statistics.
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