Quality RP or plagiarism?

[Rogue]

In further defense to Luis. I really find it respectable he took his responsibility. Like really respectable. I know its a hard thing to do from personal experience. So it takes some courage to do so. I think a central place for finding articles that have been plagarized could work. But it shouldnt be public in my opinion. I dont like the idea of publicly putting it all out there. But i respect it if a majority thinks it should.

[Kubrick]

I'm glad work was finally made out of this, I've been saying it for years. Especially in recent times it has more or less destroyed my motivation to RP and develop something since people just en masse push out plagiarized content. It makes the entire rankings bullshit based on bullshit. Firm action and reform is the only way. Retro-active reform.

[jamescfm]

Following up on what Kubrick has just said, we have still not received any public response from Masionette or Maxington. In the former case it's plausible he isn't actually aware of this thread because it seems he has not posted in the past ten days or so. The latter seems to have less excuse given that he has been active on the forum, posting articles in the Kazulian news thread and making requests to Moderation. I don't want to engage in any sort of mob justice but it does seem that these players should be held accountable for their actions.

The argument could be made that technically those who plagiarised did not literally break any rules and should not be the subject of sanctions. I don't find this to be a credible position and believe that Moderation should sanction the players for their actions (taking into account the extent of the problem, the degree of remorse and so on). I do not think it is reasonable to suggest that anybody engaged in plagiarism was unaware that what they were doing was wrong. Could Moderation perhaps let us know what action is being taken against these players and whether they have disclosed the full extent of their plagiarism?

[Reddy]

IJames and Kubs, I fully share your anger and disgust at the plagiarism but it would not be fair to punish any players for something which was not prohibited at the time that they did it. I know this is not a court of law but I think we should adhere to as high standards of basic justice as possible.

[Kubrick]

I think a firm warning and reforming the ranking system is not punishing those who plagiarized, but more of a "let's correct what we fucked up" kind of thing. I'm not looking for players to be punished. Unless you see altering the ranking system as punishment, then yes.

[Reddy]

Ah sorry about that. I misunderstood what you meant or rather, clumped it together with James' statements

[jamescfm]

I think it would be unfair if players were to face particularly harsh sanctions (i.e. inactivation) and I don't think they should be punished in this way. Nonetheless I don't think they should be able to continue playing the game as if they have done nothing wrong. At the very minimum I think the Moderation team should send them a warning and "keep an eye" on their behaviour so that they don't simply wait for this to blow over and then return to plagiarising (perhaps in a less obvious manner).

My personal view is that they should also be expected to apologise and reveal the full extent of the plagiarism that they have conducted. The fact is that the Game Rules aren't a prescriptive list and no reasonable person would make the argument that they thought plagiarism was acceptable. Until fairly recently it was explicitly prohibited and none of the players so far implicated are especially new to the game.

As has already been mentioned, Luis has openly acknowledged his wrongdoing but neither of the two other known plagiarisers (Maxington and Masionette) has done this. I don't think it is fair that they should be able to continue playing the game as normal until they are honest about they've done, which is to lie about the source of their work in an attempt to cheat the rankings system, and I hope that Moderation will consider taking some kind of action.

[Luis1p]

I think it would be unfair if players were to face particularly harsh sanctions (i.e. inactivation) and I don't think they should be punished in this way. Nonetheless I don't think they should be able to continue playing the game as if they have done nothing wrong. At the very minimum I think the Moderation team should send them a warning and "keep an eye" on their behaviour so that they don't simply wait for this to blow over and then return to plagiarising (perhaps in a less obvious manner).

My personal view is that they should also be expected to apologise and reveal the full extent of the plagiarism that they have conducted. The fact is that the Game Rules aren't a prescriptive list and no reasonable person would make the argument that they thought plagiarism was acceptable. Until fairly recently it was explicitly prohibited and none of the players so far implicated are especially new to the game.

As has already been mentioned, Luis has openly acknowledged his wrongdoing but neither of the two other known plagiarisers (Maxington and Masionette) has done this. I don't think it is fair that they should be able to continue playing the game as normal until they are honest about they've done, which is to lie about the source of their work in an attempt to cheat the rankings system, and I hope that Moderation will consider taking some kind of action.

For the sake of transparency, I will continue to explain where most of the plagiarism I committed started. And again, I already stated why I plagiarized in the first place. It still doesn't change the fact that I was clearly in the wrong.

Now, the last post I posted before plagiarism began was this post: (1) viewtopic.php?f=17&t=4275&start=640#p153935

the plagiarism then began after this post: (2) viewtopic.php?f=17&t=4275&start=640#p154295

I just want to put into account the time gap between these posts and refer as to why I plagiarized, but that doesn't matter at this point. Everything before the first link I posted is all original. Some of the articles after the second link I posted are plagiarized. I think for the most part most of them have already been exposed on here. Not every article I posted after the second link I provided are plagiarized. I'm pretty sure most of them have already been put on display in this thread, I honestly can't remember if there are any more.

I don't think an "inactivation" or "ban from the game is reasonable to be fair. I know I plagiarized, it was wrong, and I apologized. It wasn't against the rules, but again still doesn't change the fact that it was wrong. I don't expect my posts to go "un-reviewed" in the future. Logically, after someone goes through all this exposure, you're not expected to be seen with the same integrity as before. So yes, I do expect moderation to keep an eye on my RP, and other players as well.Even if they tell me or not. And no, I'm not continuing the plagiarism after this blows over. My word may not be trusted on this, but I mean, I simply don't want to get banned from the game in the future. I want to and will continue to play the game, I don't think it would be fair to take extreme consequences over how I've explained myself and the action I have taken to address this.

[jamescfm]

Sorry, I think probably I was being unclear about what I meant. The comments about players just playing the game as if nothing happened don't apply at all to you. Primarily they were directed at Maxington who has been active on the forum- including posting articles in the Kazulian national news thread- despite offering no public apology or even acknowledging his wrongdoing. They apply to Masionette to a lesser extent, since although he hasn't been posting on the forum in the past few days, his in-game account is still active.

[Aquinas]

The fact is that the Game Rules aren't a prescriptive list and no reasonable person would make the argument that they thought plagiarism was acceptable. Until fairly recently it was explicitly prohibited and none of the players so far implicated are especially new to the game.

This is patently correct. There really is no excuse. Plagiarism is not just dishonest and not just completely against the ethos of a RPing game like Particracy, but it is also against the law.

Sorry, I think probably I was being unclear about what I meant. The comments about players just playing the game as if nothing happened don't apply at all to you. Primarily they were directed at Maxington who has been active on the forum- including posting articles in the Kazulian national news thread- despite offering no public apology or even acknowledging his wrongdoing. They apply to Masionette to a lesser extent, since although he hasn't been posting on the forum in the past few days, his in-game account is still active.

I feel we also need to have a discussion about Moderation, who openly say they knew plagiarism was going on but did nothing about it and treated it as though it was acceptable for Particracy Forum RP. In effect, they betrayed the community's trust just as much as the players who passed off material written by other people as though it was their own. Put it this way, if you were the group leader of an academic project at university, and it emerged you had not plagiarised yourself and you claimed you did not like plagiarism, but nevertheless you knew others on your team were plagiarising and did nothing to blow the whistle...your tutor would likely not be impressed and you would probably be in danger of being thrown off your course.

It would appear the attitude towards plagiarism exhibited in public by Yolo over the last few days is not massively radically different from the attitude exhibited in private by Moderation over a much more extended period of time.

If an apology is to be expected from the plagiarisers, an apology should also be expected from those who enabled the plagiarising. To do otherwise would be hypocritical and giving special treatment to those in positions of privilege. Wouter also ought to have the courtesy to come to this thread and explain himself. Did he authorise the Moderators to allow plagiarism? If so, why? If not, how on earth did he manage to allow this to happen, and what kind of oversight is he providing for the game he is responsible for? How does he want this community to move forwards on this issue?

I completely agree the plagiarisers should not be able to carry on playing the game as though they have done nothing wrong. And on that note, James, I turn to you, as the World Congress Co-ordinator. The World Congress is meant to be one of the premier institutions of RP in the game, and to showcase the best that Particracy RP has to offer. How sure are you that it is appropriate for nations in the Security Council to be controlled by plagiarisers? Should those players perhaps be asked to excuse themselves from the Security Council, at least for a certain period of time? In the interests of balance/fairness, if this was to be done, it probably ought to be applied to the plagiarism enablers (ie. Farsun and Vesica) as well.