Does Satan Exist?

[Aethers]

I think it's more likely, based on the little I know of Satanism, that Satanists would think that evil is a kind of good. But thinking that God is evil is a bit less tortured in its logic.

(Personally, I believe in neither, so it's an amusing intellectual exercise for me.)

[Molotov]

I think PresM has some odd ideas, too. I don't understand his rationale for the Devil either.

I'd like to know which part is unclear (or "odd") because in my opinion there are many clear statements that indicate the presence of a great evil in the form of the Prince of this World aka Satan.

That you think that the Devil is involved in events you might consider evil on this Earth. I mean, it's not odd, lots of people think like that. As an excuse for evil, though, it doesn't work. The Devil, if he exists in the form you described, is doing the work of God. Man is the only source of evil, as to commit an evil act it must be through choice, and we (unlike the Angels, fallen or otherwise) have free will and the choice it grants.

[PresMusharraf]

I think PresM has some odd ideas, too. I don't understand his rationale for the Devil either.

I'd like to know which part is unclear (or "odd") because in my opinion there are many clear statements that indicate the presence of a great evil in the form of the Prince of this World aka Satan.

That you think that the Devil is involved in events you might consider evil on this Earth. I mean, it's not odd, lots of people think like that. As an excuse for evil, though, it doesn't work. The Devil, if he exists in the form you described, is doing the work of God. Man is the only source of evil, as to commit an evil act it must be through choice, and we (unlike the Angels, fallen or otherwise) have free will and the choice it grants.

doing the work of God? How so? The Devil broke ranks with God. How then can he do God's will?

[Molotov]

God required him to rebel, as it was necessary to have something to compare God with, something wrong so that God might be right. God knew from the moment He made Lucifer that Lucifer would rebel - each Angel is its purpose. (He made him a general, after all, first of His host. Why should He do this, in the time before time, when there was no one to make war on?) There are differing accounts for the reasons for Lucifer's rebellion, jealousy of man, compassion for the apparent injustice of God's actions when He destroyed the first Angel who fell in love and committed the first murder of all time (but that, again, was the Angel's purpose, to fall in love and murder his lover, so that Lucifer might see God's punishment and think it unjust.)

It is impossible that Lucifer (if it is Lucifer who is the Devil) does not do God's work, else it would mean that God is fallible, that God is not omniscient or omnipotent. However, that does not mean Lucifer loves God or is in God's light, only that, through ignorance, he fulfils the purpose for which he was made.

[Opakidabar]

Yes. Randomly splattering people who also (randomly, of course) stated their outright hatred for the God of Jacob and Isaac? Who knew what is moral and right (even by atheistic standards) and rejected it anyway? Nowadays, we call these people dictators, tyrants, and terrorists, and we wage war against them in the name of all that is good in this world. How, then, can we justify our acts of war against evils if we criticize God for doing the same?

Sodomites?
Dear God!

[Opakidabar]

Now I have another idea. God loves SM games with the people.
First, he makes up criteria that no healthy man can follow (which also includes calling God your only master )
Second, he punishes those that fail in the criteria
Third, he sacrifices himself to save the same men that fails on criteria

I strongly believe that Mr Abraham God is simply not good. A big baby. Mr Jesus God is better. Maybe he grew up.

[elryacko]

Maybe we all exist as part of some teenager's universal simulation game. Fortunately he's bothering some other intelligent race right now.

[Opakidabar]

Maybe we all exist as part of some teenager's universal simulation game. Fortunately he's bothering some other intelligent race right now.

Maybe he is just a game developer and we are characters in the game played by our souls.
That would explain reincarnation very well. "Game Over, do you want to start a new game? Yes/No." Guy thinks for a day or two, in game it means like 50-100 years, and decides "well, all right, have never played as Japanese".

[JuliaAJA]

doing the work of God? How so? The Devil broke ranks with God. How then can he do God's will?

It is a matter of balance, good cannot exist without bad, bad cannot exist without good. Silly christian and your "Devil" not working with your "God."

Maybe we all exist as part of some teenager's universal simulation game. Fortunately he's bothering some other intelligent race right now.

Maybe he is just a game developer and we are characters in the game played by our souls.
That would explain reincarnation very well. "Game Over, do you want to start a new game? Yes/No." Guy thinks for a day or two, in game it means like 50-100 years, and decides "well, all right, have never played as Japanese".

That's a good explananation.

[Amazeroth]

That you think that the Devil is involved in events you might consider evil on this Earth. I mean, it's not odd, lots of people think like that. As an excuse for evil, though, it doesn't work. The Devil, if he exists in the form you described, is doing the work of God. Man is the only source of evil, as to commit an evil act it must be through choice, and we (unlike the Angels, fallen or otherwise) have free will and the choice it grants.

doing the work of God? How so? The Devil broke ranks with God. How then can he do God's will?

Again basically what Molotv said. It is called causa secunda and means that even though the individual is doing evil, God still planned that something good comes from it.
I wouldn't go as far as Molotov and say that the Devil is doing God's will, I'd say that even if the Devil broke ranks with God forever, something good comes out of it, and that's the freedom of choice.

Now I have another idea. God loves SM games with the people.
First, he makes up criteria that no healthy man can follow (which also includes calling God your only master )
Second, he punishes those that fail in the criteria
Third, he sacrifices himself to save the same men that fails on criteria

I strongly believe that Mr Abraham God is simply not good. A big baby. Mr Jesus God is better. Maybe he grew up.

So you really don't have a clue? Never read the bible? Never read anything serious about that matter?