English devolution 'could save UK'

[EEL123]

In my view the House of Lords would have to become a Senate based on the US Senate where each member-state elects the same number of Senators (say 50 each). That'd be fairer too.

I don't believe that that'd be fair, considering that England has the vast bulk of the UK's population. With nearly twenty times the population of Wales, under your proposal, it would have the same representation.

[EEL123]

The House of Commons' constituencies would still remain the same, with the vast majority of MPs representing English constituencies.

But the Lords would just be so skewed against England.

[EEL123]

I've heard soysauce (as Scot) say that he finds it unfair that the UK government is determined by how the English electorate votes.

They've got more people, so I think that it's fair.

As for a "Senate", I think that the Penrose method could be used. Let's say that it'd have a 250 members, which is reasonably large but not too massive (like the current Lords). Thus, England would have 145 members, Scotland 45, Wales 34 and Northern Ireland 26. Using a fully proportional system, England would have 210, Scotland 21, Wales 12 and Northern Ireland 7.

[soysauce]

I've heard soysauce (as Scot) say that he finds it unfair that the UK government is determined by how the English electorate votes.

They've got more people, so I think that it's fair.

The problem only stems from the fact that the Conservatives have little want or need to assist or invest in us as it will not maintain or improve their support here, we simply don't vote for them.
While you may say that this is unimportant as the entire country voted you will notice that there is no larger (and very few smaller) homogeneous group of people in the same region with such distinct views, the situation is rather like Denmark being run by Germany albeit with a common language and 300 years of history together, The views of English, Welsh and Northern Irish people are very distinct from Scottish people's, not to mention each other's.

I'm guessing an executive council of leaders of UK member nations with Veto powers for laws affecting their nation wouldn't be well recieved?

I'm also surprised that the Scottish government budget is not set by percentage of GDP, the current system is open to abuse.

[EEL123]

I guess an equal Senate may be workable if it were weak like the House of Lords - so if you piss off one nationality, they won't be able to stop it, but they can cause you one hell of a lot of trouble.

[EEL123]

I imagine, however, that my 'Senate' idea would result in fierce arguments between the more left-wing Scotland and Wales and the more right-wing England and Northern Ireland.

Probably would.

[Siggon Kristov]

I think that England should have its own assembly separate from the UK's. It could have a government and a legislature that focuses solely on England. It's members would dominate the UK Assembly (the House of Commons in London) but that's not the issue here. Each of the 4 nations should have its own Premier and local council of ministers. It is likely that the Prime Minister of the entire UK will be English (because the English will dominate the parliament), but that doesn't mean the English and the UK should be considered to be the same thing. England needs its own autonomy from the UK.

If the other nations have their own autonomy, while England doesn't, it simply means that those nations are allowed to affect England's laws while England isn't allowed to affect their laws (assuming more autonomy will be granted to these assemblies in the future).

[soysauce]

I think that England should have its own assembly separate from the UK's. It could have a government and a legislature that focuses solely on England. It's members would dominate the UK Assembly (the House of Commons in London) but that's not the issue here. Each of the 4 nations should have its own Premier and local council of ministers. It is likely that the Prime Minister of the entire UK will be English (because the English will dominate the parliament), but that doesn't mean the English and the UK should be considered to be the same thing. England needs its own autonomy from the UK.

If the other nations have their own autonomy, while England doesn't, it simply means that those nations are allowed to affect England's laws while England isn't allowed to affect their laws (assuming more autonomy will be granted to these assemblies in the future).

Why does it not matter if the parliament is English dominated?

[Siggon Kristov]

Why does it not matter if the parliament is English dominated?

What are you talking about, and why is this question directed to me as if I said that "it doesn't matter" if the parliament is English-dominated?

[soysauce]

Why does it not matter if the parliament is English dominated?

What are you talking about, and why is this question directed to me as if I said that "it doesn't matter" if the parliament is English-dominated?

Well, em you felt fit to propose a system which left the parliament English dominated, I assume that you as a Socialist would only propose a system that was fair and thus your entire system would be fair for everyone.
Theirfore my question is either depending on your viewpoint 1: Why is it fair that the UK Parliament is English dominated? or 2: Why did you propose an unfair system?