Requests: Cultural Protocols - CPs [M]

[Aquinas]

Passed: http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=456505

I need to query the reduction of Malivians from 80% to 51% and the creation of a new Malivian-Dundorfian group ("Dunvian") accounting for 31% of the population. This looks like a substantial change. Can you explain what's going on there?

[Farsun]

Passed: http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=456505

I need to query the reduction of Malivians from 80% to 51% and the creation of a new Malivian-Dundorfian group ("Dunvian") accounting for 31% of the population. This looks like a substantial change. Can you explain what's going on there?

Malivia was like a Colonial-era Germanic-based country for a while, no one ever explained what the name of that group was but Malivia then underwent a serious period where its Dundorfic-culture was neglected entirely, so I imagine that many Dundorfians would have left the country during that time.

Addendum: To note, the growth of pro-Dundorfian sentiment in Northern Artania also would've likely attracted people back up North.

[Darky57]

Passed: http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=456505

I need to query the reduction of Malivians from 80% to 51% and the creation of a new Malivian-Dundorfian group ("Dunvian") accounting for 31% of the population. This looks like a substantial change. Can you explain what's going on there?

Sure! I simply resumed the tracking of mixed race Malivians, which was removed from the last couple of cultural protocols. My numbers were based on ALL previous cultural protocols and forecasting a conservative growth rate based on those numbers of existing mixed race Malivians and those that would have returned under the more racially tolerant government. Going back almost 300 years, only the last cultural protocol has Malivians at 80%, and it is the only one to exclude those of mixed race. My only real "new" change was giving them the name "Dunvian" instead of calling them "mixed race" or "Dundorfian-Malivians." Here are some snapshots from the various cultural protocols of Malivia. I could have went back further, but I decided to stop at 3700.

Example of historical Cultural Protocals for Malivia tracking mixed race:

Race: (numbers from 3675 Census):
Malivians: 59.8% (63.7%)
Mixed (Dundorfian/Malivian): 17.9% (14.6%)
Dundorfians: 13.3% (13.1%)
Alorians: 3.8% (3.7%)
Hobrazians: 2.4% (2.3%)
Luthorians: 2.8% (2.6%)
http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=417434

Race: (numbers from 3700 Census):
Malivians: 57.1% (59.8%)
Mixed (Dundorfian/Malivian): 20.3% (17.9%)
Dundorfians: 13.5 (13.3%)
Alorians: 3.9% (3.8%)
Hobrazians: 2.4% (2.4%)
Luthorians: 2.8% (2.8%)
http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=417434

Census of 3750
Population: 99,475,917
Race:
Malivians: 58.4%
Mixed (Dundorfian/Malivian): 18.4%
Dundorfians: 11.6%
Alorians: 4.0%
Hobrazians: 2.9%
Luthorians: 2.5%
Other: 2.2%
http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=420803

Malivians: 53.4%
Mixed (Dundorfian/Malivian): 16.4%
Dundorfians: 10.6%
Baltusians : 8 %
Alorians: 4.0%7
Hobrazians: 2.9%
Luthorians: 2.5%
Other: 2.2%
http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=421828

Malivians: 53.4%
Mixed (Dundorfian/Malivian): 16.4%
Dundorfians: 10.6%
Baltusians : 8 %
Alorians: 4.0%7
Hobrazians: 2.9%
Luthorians: 2.5%
Other: 2.2%
http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=422297

Malivians: 63.4% (59.8%)
Mixed (Dundorfian/Malivian): 18.1% (17.9%)
Dundorfians: 11% (13.3%)
Alorians: 3.6% (3.8%)
Hobrazians: 2.2% (2.4%)
Luthorians: 1.7% (2.8%)
http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=423515

Malivians: 65.4% (63.4%)
Mixed (Dundorfian/Malivian): 17.6% (18.1%)
Dundorfians: 10.5% (11%)
Alorians: 3.1% (3.6%)
Hobrazians: 1.7% (2.2%)
Luthorians: 1.2% (1.7%)
Others: 0.5%
http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=449270

Race (as a percent of the population): Current, (Previous)
• 80% (82%) Malivian 'Malay' http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Malivian
• 11% (10%) Dundorfians 'Germans' http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Dundorfians
• 4% (4%) Alorians 'Welsh' http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Alorian_Ethnicity
• 2% (2%) Hobrazians 'Georgian' http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Hobrazians
• 2% (3%) Luthorians 'English' http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Luthorians
• 1% Others
http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=452660

[Aquinas]

I hear what you are saying, but even so I can only presume the Malivian-Dundorfian group was removed in order to reflect its cultural assimiliation into the majority (Malivian) population. To increase the "Dunvians" from 0% to 31% now would be too big a change to make in one go.

If you passed a new Cultural Protocols update bill, I would be happy to accept a smaller number. Perhaps 10%? Anything more than that, and I'd need to see role-play evidence for it (including links to bills, news posts etc.).

[Darky57]

I hear what you are saying, but even so I can only presume the Malivian-Dundorfian group was removed in order to reflect its cultural assimiliation into the majority (Malivian) population. To increase the "Dunvians" from 0% to 31% now would be too big a change to make in one go.

If you passed a new Cultural Protocols update bill, I would be happy to accept a smaller number. Perhaps 10%? Anything more than that, and I'd need to see role-play evidence for it (including links to bills, news posts etc.).

I'm not sure I follow your logic. Cultural assimilation <> a change in ethnic race. That would be like calling all mixed race Asian-Americans of Asian and Caucasian descent white because they have a white parent.
I have demonstrated historical Role-playing precedent was clearly set for a sizable mixed race population within Malivia, and then a single bill 4 years after the last cultural protocol 3916 to 3920) has 20% of its population either was destroyed, or was lumped back into the main population on a legislative technicality. The first is drastically more unlikely because I doubt Moderation would have approved any sort of population change on that scale within that small of a time period (4 in game years) - if it was ever sent for approval at all. Because of this, that leaves me with the latter option as the only logical explanation. I am simply returning to the ethnic precedent set by 300 years of role-played historical cultural protocols as was established before the anomaly.

If your issue is with the amount the increase takes place over the last 34 in game years, from 17.6% to 31%, I am very open to reducing the increase. But otherwise, I don't understand what issue you would have with following established role played racial demographics.

[Aquinas]

After having done some research into this situation (including correspondence with knizer, a previous Malivia player), I can see some confusion has crept in, because some of those Cultural Protocols you refer to were never actually presented to and accepted by Moderation, so they were never official.

Malivia's current Cultural Protocols mention no mixed Malivian-Dundorfian population. Nor do the Cultural Protocols which existed before that.

[Wland]

http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill. ... lid=457542

Please and thank you.

RP explanation of changes:

-Irreligion grew. All players of Darnussia have agreed that we want to have a modern country (like in nowadays Netherlands, Scandinavia, Germany, Australia & NZ...). And all modern western countires have a high percentage of irreligious people, especially sweden. So we agreed, that Darnussia will follow the example of northern europe, which is realistic. Check the number of irreligious people in sweden. With time, especially due to higher standards and more education, people started to lose their faith/belief.

-A new minority started to grow in the NW of the country, because of the high immigration rate from Luthori and other english-speaking countries (mostly because of business oppurtunities). But as you see it remains small.

[Aquinas]

http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill.php?billid=457542

Please and thank you.

RP explanation of changes:

-Irreligion grew. All players of Darnussia have agreed that we want to have a modern country (like in nowadays Netherlands, Scandinavia, Germany, Australia & NZ...). And all modern western countires have a high percentage of irreligious people, especially sweden. So we agreed, that Darnussia will follow the example of northern europe, which is realistic. Check the number of irreligious people in sweden. With time, especially due to higher standards and more education, people started to lose their faith/belief.

-A new minority started to grow in the NW of the country, because of the high immigration rate from Luthori and other english-speaking countries (mostly because of business oppurtunities). But as you see it remains small.

This would increase Darnussia's irreligious population from 9% to 64%. That represents a very substantial rise. I'm not convinced you have so far presented a strong enough and detailed enough case for doing that. If you wanted to propose another Cultural Protocols update bill, I would accept an increase to 20%, but anything bigger than that would need to be justified by real RP evidence (including providing links to bills, news posts, etc.).

[Farsun]

Darnussia and Narik are the last country that should peacefully co-exist within their nation quite frankly. Extensive, extensive RP has been done to show that bitter divide between the mainlanders and the islanders. That bitter conflict has indeed been a violent conflict and at times a fragile peace. To state it wants to become a "modern" country is a little whacky to be honest. To remove that bitter divide between the two people is also incredibly detrimental to the history of country and the game.

[Farsun]

After having done some research into this situation (including correspondence with knizer, a previous Malivia player), I can see some confusion has crept in, because some of those Cultural Protocols you refer to were never actually presented to and accepted by Moderation, so they were never official.

Malivia's current Cultural Protocols mention no mixed Malivian-Dundorfian population. Nor do the Cultural Protocols which existed before that.

Irrespective, it was EXTENSIVELY RP'd and I know that our fellow, active Moderator Amaz can attest to that.